Thread: Burlesque artists getting paid now and again

Originally Posted by Kittie

It's not the public's responsibility to pay for the training or past time of those who wish to enter show business.

Hear, hear Kittie (clap, clap).

ok, looooong post alert.....

I'm going to mention pro wrestling here but bear with me as the similarities between that and the burlesque world are spooky!.
Firstly burley,

As a promoter, show booker at a venue that promotes and encourages the Burlesque/Kitch/Retro lifestyle I have booked our previous shows with local performers with specific themes. Lately we've branched out to glasgow and aberdeen. All fees agreed in advance and all girls paid on the night after their acts.

We have "NEVER" asked for our customers to pay a ticket price as we see our shows more as an introduction to Burlesque for the local comunity and also as a networking event for Edinburghs burlesque scene. Secondly, our show usually lands the night before a more high profile event such as, VEGAS or VaVa Voom. This gives our customers a taster of what a big burley show can put on OR an alternaive if they can't get the saturday night off...........As a promoter this also means that there are performers coming into the area for these bigger shows and they might take another smaller show on to help them pay for travel/beer money. In wrestling, if a big independant star comes over from the states to do a big show he will usually take on as many smaller bookings as possible to make the most of the outlay for Plane tickets, work permits and other expenses that can cost up to £4000 (in my experience for an ex WWE star). The main promoter will take the hit and pimp out the star to as many smaller promotions , for a reduced rate, in order to claw back some dough. These "subcontracts" are usually split 75/20 in favour of the wrestler.

Here's a scenario........Dita Von Tease comes over to Headline a VEGAS night at ocean terminal. Say they lay out £1000 altogether. The promoter then scours the scene for other shows within 3 days either side of the event and contacts the event promoters saying "We have Dita coming over - she can do signings, classes, talks, performances for £xxx negotiable on these dates" please contact the Vegas organisers yadda yadda. Obviously this has to be discussed with Dita in advance.

Maybe they call me or Dee Itsy among others and we get an intercnational star for a discounted rate.....everyone wins, especially the performer.

Back to basics. My next show is a charity show, raising money for Scottish cANCER cARE. I have 5 noobies on the show and a lovely girl who has done an act for me before and I hope to have her over again next month (paid gigs) to headline. The noobies are getting up to £30 towards travel etc and the chance to earn a Paid slot at my next show. I am charging £5 for this one but ALL procedes are going to scottish cancer care as we aim to raise £500 on the night. We did £250 last time just with raffles and sponsorship for Mo-Vember type moutstache growing LOL.

Other promoters have been invited as well as local freelance journos, this will be a pretty good Expose for the newcomers. Hopefully

There are ways to actively run shows and have an ethical slant as regard to performers payments or perks as well as benefits to the promoter.....we own the venue so we hope to turn a profit with drinks sales see?


I have to feed my baby but I'll edit this later!

jimi

Jimi,

A couple of quick observations...

You work for a venue and so presumably make your money through beer sales and also consequently have a lot of cash at your disposal? This would explain how you can offer free entry and pay cash on the night - I'm glad I don't try and put on a show near you, but wish I lived near the venue! Most of us have to hire a venue and never get to see any of the beer money which makes this unviable. Also, we find that most of our ticket sales are online and close to the event meaning that we don't have the cash to pay for performers on the night unless we personally finance it...

If you're selling tickets to people outside of the burly bubble, Dita is the only person who's likely to draw in sales with their name and she costs a lot more than £1000! Most other performers tend to have day jobs to go back to and so don't tend to hang around too long before/after the show so again this model wouldn't work most cases. I only speak from England, maybe it's different in Scotland/Edinburgh?

Hi again,

Instead of editing my previous post I'll follow from Mr thorpes.

I'd actually encourage more shows in our city as it would help to build a regular scene that, if not overloaded with shows all producing the same formula, could help generate a steady 2nd income for the best performers.

BTW - the Dita situation was completely hypothetical, just using an obvious name there and a money figure pulled from my ass. It's a model that does work as it is used frequently in the uk/japan and to an extent ...in the usa. That's wrestling though and as you said she's not going to be cheap so the timing would have to be right.

By managing a venue, yes you can recoup cost of performers BUT unlike the likes of the Voodoo Rooms (cool place), my pub is set on a corner in a lonely part of town but not a mile from Princes Street that doesn't have a budget to spend. I have to make their costs on the night. Since I've been with the venue I've yet to see an unsuccesful show night.......phew. We MUST offer free entry to attract anyone to the bar to buy food and drinks. We don't rake it in at all unfortunately but we work F'ing hard at making our shows memorable nights and keep ourselves afloat.

This might be a good time to say to you all that if you want to run/promote your own Burlesque type show at my venue (most of you know where - or can P.M. me) get in touch and we can cut a deal. I love these events but they take up a lot of my Father / Son time and that's the most important thing to me right now. I also don't get paid except for my normal working shift - i.e. I guest compere/DJ and mix drinks and serve tables as well as setting up the floorspaces and sound systems......folks it's a one man band until shownight! It's never perfect but it's what I can do for the money and time available and so far it's stayed fun and enjoyable for all.

We do Burlesque because it's fun, run shows to entertain and make a bit of money and send praise/complain on these boards because we bloody can! If we help each other out without stepping on toes or upsetting our loyal customers then I'm all for it.

There's somethinggood happening in scottish burlesque lately. More shows, and more performers and hopefully more fans.

jimi

I recently advertised a night with zero budget but for one obvious reason, completly for a charity, with us having everything so far donated (e.g. decorations, venue and even some posters) so we really do have no budget.

I am hoping to do a show later in the year myself with some description of a budget.

I have recently started promoting a burlesque night on the Wirral called the Cherry Lounge and would not dream of asking anyone to perform for free-this seems so unfair on performers and long term just not a sustainable business model. One thing I can say though is promoting a night out of your own pocket is terribly nerve wracking and Ive done everything from delivering leaflets about my events through doors in the rain and walking shop to shop to put posters up to spread the word and often right up until the night you dont know if you will do anything except break even. All our performers are paid their full rate including travel and paid on arrival we love burlesque and want our night to gain a reputation as a lovely place to work so that established performers will choose to come. Interestingly though we recently have decided we would like to have a "newcomers" spot alongside our exspereinced performers and we would look to pay travel exspenses only for this performer as we would only exspect them to do one dance and it to be a chance for them to perform in a supportive enviroment and if they wanted to get photographs or filming done a way to get their CV togther and of course its great for our audiance who will hopfuly see an exciting new talent just starting out. I dont feel this is exploiting performers and would hate if it came across as this so have found this thread really interesting-keep the debates going xx

I only just discovered this thread now,such a slow coach!

I moved to London from Dublin in February 2009 and having been greatly involved in the burlesque scene at home,I realised coming over here that I would be starting from scratch and I was not only prepared to do so,but excited to begin my new adventure. I set about emailing and contacting every promoter,club and contact I could find to introduce myself. Some responded,some didn't. One promoter responded very positively; said that they had heard of me through a mutual friends in the scene in Ireland and offered me a spot on new show starting in a month or two. I responded with my proposed act for the night,rate and travel expenses which was met with the "no budget.new night,great exposure" line. Now,I had decided that I would give myself 6 months of 'exposure' before charging rate and expenses,but considering this promoter was very experienced,knew of my reputation and was so enthusiastic I had thought I'd be compensated. My instincts said no,but I spoke with some friends and decided to do the show. A few emails were sent between myself and the promoter,I requested fliers for the event so as to do some promotion myself (and therefore more exposure for me). I was told I'd be the 8th performer on the night in a line-up of 10 acts (i.e. performing at the end of the show).

I arrived at the venue early,as I always do to discover that I had been moved and was now the first act up. This shook me somewhat,but I bit my tongue and performed. At the end of the show,I approached the promoter to collect my music and to say goodbye and was told that "We definitely want to have you perform at our August show,and we will pay you next time" I was very happy with that,felt I had proved myself as a performer and that it had been worthwhile after all. A month later I received an email form the same promoter,"We would love you to come and perform at our August show,and can offer you £10 and the second slot on the bill"

It took me a week to reach simmering point and respond with a very polite,but curt"Thanks,but no thanks.It doesn't even cover my transport" response.

Now,I'd been promised experience,that was experience. Never again.

Last week I performed at a charity event,for free as I felt it an extremely worthwhile cause. They had a driver pick me up,and drop me home. There was a three course vegan feast and champagne in my dressing room and they had my business cards on each placemat at the dinner. It was one of the nicest,most rewarding performing experiences I've ever had.

So my advice is to always go with your gut.If you think it sounds dodgy,it is.

H DeV X

Some of the charity events I've done have treated the performers fantastically and to some 'charity' seems to be code for pay nothing and expect the earth. I've had one promoter try to book me only to cancel when I asked for details of the charity involved.

I've also had some promoters take advantage with the promise of 'experience in lieu of payment'. One promoter I was very happy to work for free on one occasion. She then contacted me again 6 months later asking as a favour to perform for free as she had zero budget. Considering it was very close to home and there was a promise of a couple of extra perks I decided to accept. Only to meet the organiser who didn't realise I'd been told I wasn't getting paid and made reference to my fee being given to the promoter. I wasn't very happy with this (as you can imagine) and have never been involved with another night the lady has run.

I've just been asked to try and put on a couple of shows locally for a friends bar. I know the circumstances behind the request and I know the budget is extremely small so we're currently trying to increase it but at the same time I'm trying to think of ways to get a mix of performers so have resorted to trying to start a performer swap but I hate the fact I can't offer payment to everyone and I don't want a night full of newbies which some nights seem to have resorted to in an effort to keep costs down. I do like Jimis idea though and may try and see if I can do something similar.