Thread: Politically Incorrect Music

I've been doing some research into music my burlesque alter-ego might one day be able to perform to, and I've found a fantastic piece by Irving Berlin from 1912 called 'Opera Burlesque', which really works for my character on all sorts of levels - story-telling, period etc.

But there's a Big But.

Musically it's a spoof on the sextet from 'Lucia Di Lammermoor' ( i.e. a famous bit of a famous opera).

The lyrics are the problem. Here's an extract:

This op'ra darkey
-Op'ra darkey
He bought
-Yes, he bought, yes, he bought
That score, you bet!
-That sweet sextette!
He hunted then
-He went out and hunted then
For colored men
-Colored men, colored men
Who could
-Who could
Sing that sextette he heard so beautiful
-Beautiful
Soon he found some coons who understood the harmony
-And they said: "We'll do it! Go right to it!"
So he gave them parts and said: "The hard one is for me!"

This is really the only 'dodgy' bit - the rest is perfectly inoffensive, but I'm in all sorts of quandaries : I would love to put an act together to this piece, but don't want to waste time and effort if it would prove unacceptable.
I can't doctor the words, as Berlins' work is still in copyright.
I should add that the act would play up the 'opera' side of things, and there would be no 'black and white minstrel' element, or any reference whatsoever to skin-colour/ethnicity.

I guess my questions are :

1. How offensive are these lyrics?

2. What is the difference between a 'racially indifferent' performance to this track and Mr. Joe Blacks' blacked-up Britney number, with ' neutral' words? ( I should make it very clear I'm absolutely not having a pop at the sublimely disturbed genius himself here - I bow down before and all that, and it made me laugh big-time - but I'm very interested in the intellectual point).

3. Has anyone else encountered the same problem with regard to choice of music/lyrics?
4. Has anyone ever done any research into/ have first-hand experience of being 'people of colour' in burlesque? I use the quotation marks deliberately, as I can think of some fabulous current black and Asian female performers, but no 'boylesque' examples, and can only think of a handful of non-white performers from the 'Golden Age'. Was their ethnicity an integral part of their persona, or was it irrelevant? And does it matter ?

This is such a sensitive issue these days, and actually one where as performers we can - rightly or wrongly - set the tone for the rest of the population. I grew up in an era where white classical actors could 'black up' to play Othello : something that I think would never happen now, although happily black actors can play Romeo, Hamlet, etc. And yet non-Jews can still play Shylock. What is the difference? And actually, why have I seen non-white actors playing in Shakespeare or Stoppard , but never in Wilde, or Sheridan?

Really looking forward to some intelligent and thought-provoking comments from the Community!

Viva La Belvoir

WARNING

Warning: This is an Old Thread This discussion is older than 60 days. information contained in it may no longer be current

P.S.

Dear Moderators

Please could you move this post to "Burlesque Chat' ! I posted this in the wrong Forum, and can't work out how to move it!

Thank you lots!

Vx

hey!

firstly - i moved it into burlesque chat for you!

secondly - i'm not going to say much on this,
as i always end up digging a whole.
but its all about intent and your delivery of the performance

my act is obviously very lighthearted. and with no malicious intent
but someone else attempting it, may not get the balance right - and end up upsetting a lot of people, with how they come across on stage.

if you maybe don't pay heed to that line, or just act casual about it - it shouldn't be a problem.
if you FOCUS on it however, maybe then it will prick some ears up..

I must admit, I'd feel a tad un-comfortable with those lyrics!
Not outright offended, but self-concious.

Is it possible to simply chop that bit out? Does that count as doctoring? Or would that ruin the piece?

With Mr Joe Black's routine, I was momentarily caught on the back foot a little, but the rest of the costume has such a wonderful wrongness about it that the b&w minstrel face fits in.

Hmmm. Maybe find a version of the music that's instrumental?

I'd say that unless you're addressing those lyrics in your act, which it sounds like you're not, then it might make people feel unfortable. It might me.

There's bound be another piece of music equally suitable. In the past I've had to change music for a piece and because I was pushed into it, I ended up finding a much better bit of music..

I'll try to keep this both brief and relevant (humour me...)

The piece was written in a different era, when attitudes were different and so, of course, what was deemed "acceptable" was different. That modern definitions of acceptability are far removed from those of the time does not alter the "acceptability" of a piece of work (art, music or otherwise) at the time it was created. Indeed, it would be ridiculous to simply discard / disregard any piece of work simply because of such an anachronism. I personally believe it's important to maintain an awareness of the ways in which the world has changed (since Genesis?), whether for better or worse, and one method is to remember, review and reprise the art, music, etc. of times gone by.

I hope I'm making sense - I feel I could better put the point across verbally.

I don't believe you'd be doing anything morally wrong or artistically questionable by using the music/lyrics in their original form. Logically then, nobody in your audience would have any right to be offended by your performance. The problem is - that doesn't mean they won't take offence anyway!

I feel like that doesn't help! Sorry! (again)

B.B.B.
xx

i asked a similar question a while back and the general opinion seemd to be...as long as it is done in context and tastefully then do it...but bear in mind there will always be those that just dont "get it". xxxx

[QUOTE=

2. What is the difference between a 'racially indifferent' performance to this track and Mr. Joe Blacks' blacked-up Britney number, with ' neutral' words? ( I should make it very clear I'm absolutely not having a pop at the sublimely disturbed genius himself here - I bow down before and all that, and it made me laugh big-time - but I'm very interested in the intellectual point).

3. Has anyone else encountered the same problem with regard to choice of music/lyrics?

This is such a sensitive issue these days, and actually one where as performers we can - rightly or wrongly - set the tone for the rest of the population. I grew up in an era where white classical actors could 'black up' to play Othello : something that I think would never happen now, although happily black actors can play Romeo, Hamlet, etc. And yet non-Jews can still play Shylock. What is the difference? And actually, why have I seen non-white actors playing in Shakespeare or Stoppard , but never in Wilde, or Sheridan?

Really looking forward to some intelligent and thought-provoking comments from the Community!

Viva La Belvoir[/QUOTE]

This is a very hard thing to put into words but I feel it is the indifference that is the problem.
If your act was to in some way adress or play around with the lyrics, it would be different but if they are meaningless within the context of your act it is in danger of appearing ignorant or worse like you basically just don't care which would be reminicent of the attitudes of the time.

I feel strongly that the word 'coon' really cannot be used in a 'racially indifferent' context.

I don't know one of my black friends who wouldn't flinch at the words 'colored' or 'coon' and I don't think it can be used flippantly- if they are to be used then it must have weight.
One of the worst things about the old racist attitudes was a complete lack of regard and respect for 'people of color'. Though there may be no malicious intent it would still at best be an uncomfortable reminder of an attitude and time where they didn't matter.

The history isn't that old and we are still living in the aftermath now- the word 'coon' now has very strong meaning and there's no getting away from that. I'm not saying this subject and these words cannot be used- as I feel they are relevant taboos that need to be explored BUT it must have weight and meaning .

In the case of Mr. Joe Blacks Minstrel I feel it is very different altogether. The black and white minstrels were an ugly British institution that were insulting because they grotesquely mocked black people..
Mr Joe black I feel, is satyrising a grotesque British Institution rather than mocking black people- so it's different entirely-

In the case of othello I think it probably often is PCness going a bit to far but it depends. To put it bluntly black people got a bit sick of white people slapping bootpolish on their faces and doing really poor impressions of them-I find it insulting too to be honest it's creepy.

Phew Hard work!!!

I hope I haven't been harsh, I can tell you really love the song but I'm afriad I just feel that you can't get away from the meanings sorrounding those words xxx

Originally Posted by Miss B Poppin

In the case of Mr. Joe Blacks Minstrel I feel it is very different altogether. The black and white minstrels were an ugly British institution that were insulting because they grotesquely mocked black people..
Mr Joe black I feel, is satyrising a grotesque British Institution rather than mocking black people- so it's different entirely-

i'd just like to say THANK YOU!!
every time i try to explain that, people never get what i mean!

Originally Posted by Baron Bartholomew Black

I'll try to keep this both brief and relevant (humour me...)

The piece was written in a different era, when attitudes were different and so, of course, what was deemed "acceptable" was different. That modern definitions of acceptability are far removed from those of the time does not alter the "acceptability" of a piece of work (art, music or otherwise) at the time it was created. Indeed, it would be ridiculous to simply discard / disregard any piece of work simply because of such an anachronism. I personally believe it's important to maintain an awareness of the ways in which the world has changed (since Genesis?), whether for better or worse, and one method is to remember, review and reprise the art, music, etc. of times gone by.

I hope I'm making sense - I feel I could better put the point across verbally.

I don't believe you'd be doing anything morally wrong or artistically questionable by using the music/lyrics in their original form. Logically then, nobody in your audience would have any right to be offended by your performance. The problem is - that doesn't mean they won't take offence anyway!

I feel like that doesn't help! Sorry! (again)

B.B.B.
xx

I disagree.

The lyrics contain words offensive to a large section of people, that means the audience would have a right to be offended at you, as it was your choice to play them the song.

It's acceptable to reprise this stuff if in your performance you're making a satirical comment about it, but it doesn't sound like you are, so therefore it's not a case of the audience not "getting it" as there's really nothing to get.

The music being perfect for the act is, for me, not a good enough reason to run the risk of upsetting people you don't know and have been paid to entertain.